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Author Topic: My First 52100 Blade and initial test  (Read 4106 times)
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Scott Hurst
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« on: January 13, 2007, 03:02:40 AM »

I've been working in 1095 mostly for the last 7-8 years. I liked it. It was easy.  I could heat treat it in a day.  I've got a new 1095 blade ready for heat treat tomorrow.  I just finshed my first 52100 blade with a heat treating process as close to Ed Fowler's as I can.  I ground 1/16 off of the edge and sharpened it.  I etched and buffed it to show several distinct hardening zones.  I just tried flexing it over a steel rod and it performed great.  I'll post again with all the specifics of the heat treat, but right now I have to go cut some rope. 

Next week, I'm going to put both of these blades through their paces and destructively test them.  I will post all the results in detail and show pictures if I can figure it out. 

   

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Ed Fowler
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« Reply #1 on: January 13, 2007, 04:16:57 PM »

Congradulations Scott: It will be interesting to hear how the two blades compare. It takes a while to get to know a steel, but when you concentrate on one or two you will be amazed at how far you can go.
I sincerely appreciate your posting here and look forward to hear how it goes.
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Alan
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« Reply #2 on: January 13, 2007, 05:09:38 PM »

I have been thinking about doing that vise-flex test myself on a blade.

I think it was a year ago I was reading in BLADE about a ...er.."tool-thing" that Ed had made that clamped onto the knife blade and allowed him to use a torque wrench while bending the blade.
Now in the new video I saw this new tool being used by Ed, however Ed never stopped to talk about it.

I also noted that Ed  no longer placed plywood in the vise with the blade while he bent it.
I think he used some type of angle iron?,

But it was hard to say for sure as for some (Gaud only knows ) reason the camera turns on it's side and I get kinda motion sick tring to figure out what way is up...LOL

I tal;ked to my wife, and being that it warmed up to only being -5 below zero today, she will help me forge a knife that we will attempt a full H/T on, then flex until cracked.
I hope to have her take (low-quality) video of the bend test that i can post later on YOUTUBE.

Say, Scott, any chance we might be able to see you put your knife to it's final tests?
Photos are real easy to post on Ed's website, and YouTube is totally free too...
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Ed Fowler
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« Reply #3 on: January 13, 2007, 09:15:24 PM »

I use smooth pieces of angle iron to protect the knife blade from getting scratched up with doing the bend tests. The reason I do this is that when bending a strong tough blade you will have to put a lot of muscle into flexing the blade. Any scratch can result in a stress riser and cause blade failure, especially with it comes to multiple flexes.

I put the pieces of angle iron on my belt grinder and polished to a 220 grit. Be sure to polish our test blades out before flexing, this will insure an accurate test.

These particulars will make little difference with a whimpy blade, strong blades that require a lot of muscle are an entirely different matter. Use Caution, gloves, safety glasses and never push the blade away from you, pull it toward you and if it breaks you will just go to the floor. Try to push it away from you and you could easily fall on to the blade.
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busterbones
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« Reply #4 on: January 13, 2007, 10:21:59 PM »

I hope to have her take (low-quality) video of the bend test that i can post later on YOUTUBE.  Say, Scott, any chance we might be able to see you put your knife to it's final tests?
Photos are real easy to post on Ed's website, and YouTube is totally free too...

Alan,

Regarding your message about posting video through YouTube, you can include video directly in your posts here at KTO.  Just use the appropriate message icons when posting (i.e., Flash, WindowsMedia, Quicktime, Real, and YouTube video buttons at the top).   

Let me know if you need help.

P.S. On the main page of KTO we have a new "GALLERY" section where members can post their own photo galleries that other members can review and rate.

P.P.S.  We'll be scheduling CHAT SESSIONS shortly.  Stayed tuned for dates and times.  Feel free to schedule your own chat time with others as well.

Cheers,
Jeremy
« Last Edit: January 13, 2007, 11:22:05 PM by busterbones » Logged
Alan
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« Reply #5 on: January 14, 2007, 01:39:26 AM »

Buster...I tried, could you go step by step and tell me how to post a video here?

Im useing windows media
I clicked on the right icon, but from there what next?
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busterbones
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« Reply #6 on: January 14, 2007, 06:28:10 AM »

You need to place the url path to the video bettween the handlers [youtube=425,350] insert url path here[youtube]. The video needs to be on a server (hosted somewhere.However if you are posting to you tube, cut and paste the yuotube url bettween the handlers.

Jeremy
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Alan
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« Reply #7 on: January 14, 2007, 07:22:30 AM »



well....um....well....
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Alan
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« Reply #8 on: January 14, 2007, 07:24:48 AM »

scott. can you tell me about the shape and size of the blade you are testing?

and can you tell me what types of heat treatments you do?
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Scott Hurst
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« Reply #9 on: January 14, 2007, 02:53:06 PM »

Hey Alan (any anyone esle  reading),

I just haven't had a whole bunch of time around a computer in the last day or so. I'll give all the details in the afternoon or later tonight.  The blade is 5-5-1/2", its not huge.  I forged it down from 3/4" round rod.  I did the 9 day heat treat following the 24hr cycles.  In between, the blade was in the freezer when it wasn't in my car on a freezing night.  I'll post more later. 
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busterbones
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« Reply #10 on: January 14, 2007, 04:02:25 PM »

« Last Edit: January 14, 2007, 04:08:04 PM by busterbones » Logged
Scott Hurst
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« Reply #11 on: January 15, 2007, 12:48:27 AM »

Ok, like I said, 3/4" round rod 52100 purchased from Admiral Steel.  First I forged it down to about 1" by 3/8".  Then I worked on the tip and started a slight taper and beveling.  The finished forging came out about 1/4" thick on the spine.  Durring the forging I did three flash normalizings, followed by heating it up to critical and quenching it.  Once I got it down to shape, I put it through two flash normalizing cycles followed by a full normalizing to room temperature.  After that it was heated up to just below where a magnet would stick to it and burried in a bucket of bead blasting sand.  Its actually slag.  It kept the piece hot overnight. 

The next day it was ground.  I should have put it in the freezer, but was impatient to work on it.  I left the edge about 1/8" thick.  I gave it its second annealing and follwed it with four hours in the freezer.  I annealed it the third day and when I went to take it home, left it in my car, but the temperatures dropped below freezing, so I'm not too worried. 

I hardened it three times with a torch on the edge only, bringing it up to non-magnetic and submerging it in automatic transmission fluid.  (Its just what I had, I'll find something better soon)I checked the hardness with a file, and it wouldn't bite on the edge, but would cut into the lower ricasso and the spine.  In between each hardening, I put it in the freezer overnight. 

I tempered it at 375 for 1 hour, let it cool and then another hour, three times, in 24 hour cycles.  In between tempering it was placed in the freezer. 

I ground off 1/16" of an inch off of the edge and then sharpened it.  I flexed it over a mild steel rod 6 times and it has not lost its ability to straighten, or chipped out.  I got a little crazy and tried cutting chips out of the rod and they came out.  The blade had the slightest trace of a shiny spot on its edge where it was starting to dull.  Four passes on a stone later, it was back to hair shaving sharp.  I dropped it point first onto concrete from about five feet up, and it showed no damage.  I etched the blade and it showed several lines of hardening. 

I've been having a hard time finding 1" rope.  I was able to find 3/4", so tonight I'm going to see how many cuts it will take to dull it, using one of the three bands in the line. 

Sorry for the length, I hope it wasn't too boring.  I'll get some pictures soon. 
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Alan
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« Reply #12 on: January 15, 2007, 01:04:59 AM »

Scott, when do you think you may test the blade?

 any chance of a photo of before and after the test?

I also would love to see some video of the test to learn more about how this is done.
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Scott Hurst
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« Reply #13 on: January 15, 2007, 01:26:08 AM »

I'll definitely post pictures.  I don't think I know anyone with a video camera for a youtube video.  I'll work on that.  Thanks for being interested.  I was aiming for Wednesday.  I'm working towards my Journeyman and was supposed to meet with JD Smith for knifework and some destructive testing then, but my car is acting up, so that may be on hold until I can get it straighted out.  Cars are cruel heartless things.  I may put it through its paces anyway.   
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Alan
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« Reply #14 on: January 15, 2007, 02:48:56 AM »

I don't think I know anyone with a video camera for a youtube video. 
All I got here is my wife's 2 year old PDA, and that can only take very low quality video.
But it works and it's good enough for now...

As for car problems....I could write a book of the things I have had to fix or have fixed on my truck this last year...
Im so sick of car trouble....
They make such nice cars today, all filled with such cool toys and special effects,,,,But they dont tell you that about 5 years later all the little car toys and cool things are all going to start to break,,,,
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