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Author Topic: Knife Rights  (Read 22998 times)
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radicat
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« on: February 09, 2007, 10:17:26 PM »

     The subject of "knife related laws and how we are affected by them" is worthy of extensive discussion. It is complicated and wide in scope.
     First I would like to find out what others are doing about the erosion of our rights. I posed some questions to one organization that says they are dedicated to preserving our knife rights. When there is a response/reaction to my query, I will report back to you here. Then we willl have a better understanding of the problem. I simply asked these questions.

What successes can this organization tell us about?
What politicians have established themselves as being anti-knife rights?
What politicians have demonstrated a willingness to fight for our knife rights?
What cutlery industry firms have done anything to fight for our knife rights?
What does this organization plan to do about the loss of our knife rights?
How much money do you need to post this information on this forum?

     Please feel free to begin a dialogue immediately, in reply to this post. Keep in mind that we can make more progress if we refrain from turning on one another simply because we disagree.  Politics is involved in this issue, but our aim should not be to do anything other than determine the cause of our loss of rights and what to do about it. 
     
« Last Edit: March 14, 2007, 06:44:36 PM by radicat » Logged
 
Alan
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« Reply #31 on: August 25, 2007, 09:28:29 AM »

I dont think kids should carry knives in a school setting.
It's just a bad idea that sooner or later will cause some trouble.

I carry two knives on my person each day at work,  a Leatherman and a razer knife that I use to cut stuff with as I work it.
I like the ease of use the two I carry give me, howerver I got no problem if one day in the future my boss says that we cant carry a knife anymore.  I understand the way the world is. 
I wish it would not become a big deal, but I also understand that in the modern world things happen that I cant change.
I would have to question how I'm going to be able to cut stuff at work without a knife handy?. But I can understand a company haveing to set down guidelines for all to keep.

Here in ND we can carry in a sheath whatever length of knife we want.   I happen to make a big knife from time to time and it's nice to be able to sell it and know the person can carry it and not get arrested.
But I also know full well that all it takes for a law to get introduced is for one fool to use a bigger knife to cause harm and we would soon see all kinds of new laws on the books.






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Harold Locke
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« Reply #32 on: August 25, 2007, 03:21:56 PM »

Gentlemen and Ladies,

The real deal is that as U. S. Citizens in good legal standing, we have the right to bare arms. And to abridge that right in general in any form is asking a citizen to submit to slavery. We are not the subjects of any royalty or an outdated polictical system. The system is subject to us.

With the rise again of the "New Order" on a world scale ie. China we see how world capital is fawning all over the Chinese system of worker oppression, just like they did over Hitler's industrial corporate socialist party in WWII.

It was an interesting note that Vicente Fox, Mexico's last president at his last G-8 meeting was whining that the backward citizen's of the United States were holding up the unification of the western hemisphere and stopping progress because of our refusal to disarm.

I hope that people take into account the larger picture when they make decisions on the smaller scale of things.

I don't have the link to Fox's quote but it stuck in my craw when I read the comment.

Long Live The Bill of Rights.

Harold
« Last Edit: August 25, 2007, 03:29:01 PM by Harold Locke » Logged
radicat
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« Reply #33 on: August 25, 2007, 05:51:59 PM »

Harold, thank you. That is the "real deal". We do not have to look far to see the result of over-zealous thinking that has robbed us of our rights as free people.

Our country has been experimenting with social controls for a long time. Weak minded law makers don't get it.

This problem with children being unsafe while at school is not new. In the early 1800's in rural Pennsylvania a group of young Native Americans (I was sad to read.) went to a school house, killed the Irish teacher, then nine children. One boy hid in the chimney to survive and tell the story. When the Chief of their tribe learned of this, he turned them over to be hanged. The only reminder of this tale other than a rare document that I found is an unmarked depression along-side a road where the mass grave for the children is located.

Supreme Court Justice Marshall was not against gun control, yet he was known to answer his door with a pistol in hand. It's the old "I got mine." attitude at work in the halls of justice.

When will our society wake up to what is happening?
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Ed Fowler
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« Reply #34 on: August 26, 2007, 08:07:41 AM »

When it comes to carrying a knife it is much more than a matter of self defense, it is being prepared, it is a matter of convenience, and a tool of art, self satisfaction and recreation.

Years ago I worked in a county jail - we had rules for the deputies,  one of them kind of made sense, when we entered the jail we were not to carry knives, or handguns 'because a prisoner could take them away from us and use them against others.  On top side this rule makes sense, still when we periodically shook down the jail, we almost always found some of the prisoners in posession of home made knives.

One night the underesheriff was checking the jail, found a prisoner had braided himself a rope out of strips torn from a sheet and hung himself from an upper bunk. The undersheriff tried to untie the rope, but could not as the prisoners weight had tightened the knots. The undersheriff, in violation of the rules had a pocket knife on his person, he cut the rope and prevented the suicide.

In light of the event and the facts of the matter we changed our rules, deputies could carry a pocket knife.

Being prepared to do what needs to be done is a significant part of responsable community life. It does not matter if my community consists of only me, or me and other animals. The responsable person is prepared to do what needs done because he feels this responsability, takes it seriously and commits himself to what was once known as the boy scout motto, "be prepared".

It is not enough be depend on others, depending on others is a lack of personal responsability. When others invade my ability to fill my responsabilities I resent it strongly. I would not work in an environment where I was denied this right. I will not enter a 'gun free establishment' not because I can't carry a handgun, but because I feel they a part of our generating are generating a lack of personal responsability . I will not hire anyone who is not prepared to do their job, and I do not chose them as friends.

My resentment to our school systems stems from this attitude, we are raising a new generation where being prepared is no longer a part of life. We blame tools for acts of violence or destruction rather than the individuals. Rather than placing responsability squarely on the individual, we inconvience all and abdicate responsability to others who may or may not be prepared to act.

Years ago when pocket knives were first banned on airlines, a surgeon was boarding a plane, security confiscated his pocket knife. He told them that he was a surgeon, that with his knife he could, for example preform a tracheotomy, and save a choking person. There was quite a debate, the airline personnel told him that the crew was more than competant to handle any emergencies. --- I wonder?

Prepared and responsable people (as well as animals) save many lives a day, the events are not dramatic enough to make the front page of our papers, but happen as a normal event. As we train responsability out of our lives we loose our future.
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Ed Fowler High Performance Knives
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radicat
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« Reply #35 on: November 15, 2007, 01:00:06 AM »

For a quick over-view of British knife laws go here. Think how the enactment of these laws in the U.S. would impact the knife industry and the custom knifemaker. Scarey!!

http://www.ukoutdoorstore.co.uk/safeknifeuse.html
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radicat
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« Reply #36 on: November 16, 2007, 01:22:10 AM »

To be fair, I should say that there was a time when the British government called on knife designers and makers to make an effective knife. The Fairbairn-Sykes team did it's part to save their country. There were no squeamish attitudes then. I'm sure the citizens of that country don't need to have "big brother" telling them what knife they can have today either.

Both of our countries owe much to the knifemakers and the industries that did their duty , but have been treated poorly through ill-conceived legislation ever since.


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Ed Fowler
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« Reply #37 on: November 16, 2007, 08:38:38 AM »

I truly hate to see the government of what some call our 'mother country' to become so oppressive. One would think that they would remember how poorly prepared they were when they entered WWII.
This is not a new attitude for them, when they tried to take our guns in the 1770's we rebelled, this was a good thing for we established freedom, a constitution, bill of rights and their oppression is probably responsible for our second amendment that so far has served us so well.

It is the people who allow oppression to happen and it is the people who maintain freedom. One individual, one event at a time.
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« Reply #38 on: November 16, 2007, 10:40:40 AM »

Just the way I see the general deterioration of 'rights' as a much larger scheme of general socialism. I also see it as a sign of the times, as a general globalism trend.

God gave a gift to the world when he allowed Britain , the Nations of the Common wealth, and the  United States to become a nation. Forces are working to make a 'one world government' . This may seem a to off the wall notion to some. But as our rights are chiseled away, I believe we have seen nothing yet.

Just .02 cents worth of an observation from where I am standing. America is loosing it's sovereignty, for every aspect that stands up for American sovereignty, there seems an equal aspect of opposition. Praying for our freedom(s) , and that it will be upheld , in my opinion (IMO) is not an option.

Ed

I really liked the 'Guilty till proven innocent' chapter in Knife Talk II , and one of my favorite 'Fowler' quotes' if I may? "malignant milestones of injustice" as it was used to display the indifference of bureaucrats
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« Reply #39 on: November 16, 2007, 09:02:37 PM »

I forgot all about that quote, thanks for reviving it. You have my permission to quote me any time you feel like it.

It is real easy to get lost in the big picture, I got my fill in 1979 and quit TV and big city news papers. Now I fight the little fights that come my way personally and encourage others to operate on the same level, one on one. You can wear yourself our fighting Washington and worrying about what they want us to worry about, but I find great pleasure in giving the local bureaucrats a headache.

By the way, I just figured out how to use spell check in this outfit.!!
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Ed Fowler High Performance Knives
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radicat
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« Reply #40 on: November 17, 2007, 01:36:30 AM »

If Firefox didn't spell things for me, my posts would be classified as comic relief.
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Ed Fowler
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« Reply #41 on: December 01, 2007, 05:30:45 PM »

In the last issue of Blade - Jan 08 -  I called for a revolution, not one of violence but one of introducing our fair maid, lady knife, back into our individual communities.

She has been discriminated against heavily. We have allowed this to happen, one little event at a time. How can we reverse the tide that labels her as a tyrant that takes life and promotes juvenile delinquency?

We need to bring her back to her rightful heritage as man's most valuable tool. The only way to do this is to present her in all honesty as the servant of man that she is. When we view the war in its global intensity, it is too vast to conquer, but when we look at what we can do, one tiny step at a time in our own individual community we have a chance of honestly portraying her as she really is, a tool of the resourceful man, the man who accepts responsibility to be able to respond to  exigent circumstances on his own.
This can simply be the act of rendering a fruit to our consumption or creating art from a bar of soap. Those of you that have read my article already have a head start of where this discussion is headed, those who have not received their latest Blade magazine will need a few days to catch up.

Until then, I ask those of you who have read the article to comment.
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Alan
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« Reply #42 on: December 02, 2007, 09:30:58 AM »

Years ago when pocket knives were first banned on airlines, a surgeon was boarding a plane, security confiscated his pocket knife. He told them that he was a surgeon, that with his knife he could, for example, perform a tracheotomy, and save a choking person.

One of the things I hate about going into my local hardware store is that "Nothing's marked".
There are no prices stamped on anything.
You pick something up and have no clue what it will cost you to buy.

Why?....The reason is that the price on an item can't be stamped because it depends on who you are as to how much something costs you.
There is one price for this guy, and another price for a different guy.
Big contractors will get charged one price, yet you and I will get charged another.

To me it always seems that the more money you make , the less they charge you.

Well, I think that's wrong.
I believe that there should be an equal footing in place that does not give a pricebreak to one class of people and denies it to others of a different class.

I feel the same about laws in America.
Private citizens should be equal under the laws.
The legal ability for a private citizen to carry a knife in a place where others can't should not be determined according to how "important" that private citizen thinks he is.
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radicat
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« Reply #43 on: December 02, 2007, 01:38:46 PM »

It's frustrating to feel as though you can do little to change the attitudes of society about knives. People use them daily, yet will still have this problem with others having the right to carry one.

You have to keep the faith and do whatever you can as Ed suggests. Maybe I'm consumed with thoughts about knives, but knives play a part in unexpected ways. If I'm about to vote for a candidate for office, I want to vote for the person that will most likely support my right to own and carry a knife. I can't ask each one, so I give the question an answer based on my life's experiences with people. Obama vs. Hillary??

I've run into an attitude problem about knives that isn't surprising, but it is aggravating still. I do affiliate marketing. To tell about this, I need to briefly explain how it works. Then, I'll explain how society's attitudes about knives affects that pursuit.

There are three components in affiliate marketing. The affiliate that provides space on a web-site for some type of compensation, the merchant that has a product or service to advertise, and the affiliate marketing network that gets the first two together for a fee or percentage. Some merchants don't use a network to accomplish the objective.

The affiliate, such as myself, requests to join the network to have access to the merchants. The merchants have met some criteria to join the network as well. I make a request to the  merchant to allow me to place ads on my web sites for them for a fee. The merchant sometimes will automatically give me permission, but usually will take a look at my sites to see if they want to have an association with them, regardless of what  approval has been given by the network of my sites.

Sometimes my request is denied. There are many reasons for why that may happen. What bothers me is when a representative of a firm sees the word "knife" and makes a knee-jerk decision to reject my knife link site. It saves me a lot of time to be able to apply for my knife related site and my more general "Mall" site at the same time. The merchant might approve of the mall site and reject my knife site. That just makes me mad. So, I now apply for the knife site only and if the merchant doesn't accept because of my "incorrect audience" not fitting their firm, I take careful notes to be sure that I never have that firm on any of my sites, no matter what other network they may appear under in the future. They can keep their money.

Well, you do what you can. Sometimes it doesn't seem like much, but you have to try to stand up for what is right. And, I feel so much better now that I've gotten that off my chest.                Clay
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Carey Quinn
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« Reply #44 on: December 03, 2007, 05:50:49 PM »

Clay,

I applaud your attitude.  I too have decided not to do business with people who make decisions based on political correctness.  I word for the gubment (southern term) and that stuff drives me nuts.  I have to put up with it at work for a while longer but I don't have to spend my money to support it.

When it comes to politicians, I sometimes think they are dipped in a batch of stupid right after they take the oath of office.

I should probably quit before I really get going.   Roll Eyes

Carey
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Everything you do says something about who and what you are so ALWAYS sign your work with excellence.

You are cordially invited to check out my web site:
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DanatSavageSmith
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« Reply #45 on: February 17, 2008, 03:27:46 PM »

Here is something that I'd like to know more about and something I feel we should all be thinking of:

Our Rights as Knife Owners/Makers

In my corner of the world there are some pretty ludicrous laws about knives.  In Seattle you may not have any knife over 3.5" concealed or not and the carry of any fixed blade knife concealed or not is prohibited.  Rod Chappel was recently charged with a "dangerous weapons" offense concerning a kukri in his(read: could have been any knifemaker's) car!

How can we as owners get more involved with legislation concerning our right to bear arms?  What are some stories from your area pertaining to the topic?

-Dan
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