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Author Topic: Handle Shapes....  (Read 11590 times)
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Ed Fowler
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« Reply #30 on: January 16, 2012, 04:59:14 PM »

Yes- generally speaking. Take a look or feel of a good Vaughn harmer handle, the flare at the end keeps the hammer in your hand and is much easier to use. You can do the same thing varying the geometry of your knife handle in that you don't have to make them ambidextrous. You can reduce the circumference by varying the geometry of the handle, you can pick and choose over all 360 degrees of that circumference almost at will.  Drop the top line of the handle and sculpture a recess for the pinky, and it all comes together. You can make the mid-line of the bottom of the handle fit one of all three joints of the pinky and come out well, most folks will not recognize why it feels so good, but you will know.

Just keep thinking and having fun with it.
 
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B.K. Mains
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« Reply #31 on: January 16, 2012, 06:13:18 PM »

My Green River knife. The handle was straight on top, round on the butt and the bottom goes down below the bottom of the blade where it raises to meet the bottom of the blade. This makes the circumference of the handle more at the bottom and larger than the top. Since this model was named the camp knife, I assume it was meant for chopping. The handle is 6 and a quarter inches long or so. When you chop with it slides up your hand but stops when it hits the wider part of the handle. The design was well thought out. It could of been made any way they wanted, but this is what they chose. They hammered the tang smaller on the bottom back, widening all the way up til it meets the handle.  The handle where it meets the blade is 1/4" of an inch thick and the bottom is 3/8" of an inch.

I put a handle on it since the old one was destroyed, but used the original brass pins. I finished it down to glass and then started my personal finish on it, applying between forty to 60 coats of finish I've used for the last forty years on wood.

The shape of this handle falls under the category of high performance. It was made long enough to chop and ready for action if needed....... Wink

BK......
« Last Edit: January 16, 2012, 07:31:51 PM by B.K. Mains » Logged

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georgela1
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« Reply #32 on: January 16, 2012, 07:05:26 PM »

I tried a little experiment to see if I could help explain my thoughts on handle design.

I took a 1/2", 1" and 2" piece of PVC pipe(any round material is fine) and decided to test my little finger griping power all by itself. I stared with the 1/2" and had a difficult time holding it (with just my curled pinky against my palm) while twisting the pipe with my other hand. It became less difficult with each increase in diameter. What that told me was, while my pinky helps with grip power, the smaller the diameter, the less it is able to help hold onto a round object. Since the conversation focuses mainly on the butt portion of the handle, I stopped my experiment there. Now, it is really helpful when the pinky works with the rest of the hand, but for at least one aspect of the design, I lose grip power the smaller the diameter of handle as it gets towards the butt, in my humble opinion.

Many other aspects already stated are good design concepts to keep in mind when designing a handle, which, by the way don't try to say one is better than the other because the "purpose or use of the knife" is a key factor when making a knife.

The hominid hand has had a long evonlutionary time to develop and improve so I think this post could also go on for a very long time. Certainly we as knifemakers will have job security trying to understand and design the very best we can.

Just for fun, view below

The fossil record indicates that adaptation for throwing and clubbing began to influence hand structure at or very near the origin of the hominid lineage and continued for millions of years thereafter. During this prolonged period of evolution, the hand underwent a profound remodelling that increasingly adapted it for grasping spheroids in a manner that allows precise control of release and for gripping clubhandles with strength sufficient to withstand a violent impact. Two unique human handgrips were thereby produced. Called the ?power? and ?precision? grips by Napier (1956) who identified and described them, they can also be referred to as clubbing and throwing grips on the basis of their evolutionary origins.

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« Reply #33 on: January 16, 2012, 08:27:11 PM »

These photos are of an unfinished knife, but down to final sanding and minor shaping, just some of the decisions we can make.
overall views of handle:




[

« Last Edit: January 16, 2012, 08:43:57 PM by Ed Fowler » Logged

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« Reply #34 on: January 17, 2012, 12:47:50 AM »

Nice knife really. I love that blade. Very nice.....

But the handle shape. It's basically the same as the rest, thick at the butt, a curve to the butt downward...... How should and will it be finished.......

BK...
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« Reply #35 on: January 17, 2012, 11:08:28 AM »

Still a lot of finish sanding and blending  of the irregular surfaces, still some radical aspects that are not completely friendly to the hand. The guard needs to be cleaned up and blended to the handle and the hand that will hold it. This is a very heavy duty knife, 10 inches overall, blade 5 1/2".

In the 4th photo you can see how the area where the palm of your hand meets the handle slopes down, this geometry reduces the mass of the handle and makes for a better fit for the little finger.

The irregular surface my hand like a glove and provides complete contact with the handle, I can close my eyes, hold the knife and feel no hot spots. This knife fills an order for a man who needs and used a heavy duty knife on a daily basis.
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« Reply #36 on: January 17, 2012, 03:55:50 PM »

The front of your handle shows so much thought and the back looks like it was just left basically the way it was. I know that's not true but show us the finished product and we'll have a better idea........

BK.....
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« Reply #37 on: January 17, 2012, 04:11:53 PM »

Had I taken a photo of the knife before I did the major shaping you see you would not believe it was possible to get where it is today. I hope to finish the knife this week and will post up a photo or two.
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« Reply #38 on: January 17, 2012, 05:58:40 PM »

So, will the butt be where the pinkie finger portion is the thinnest part, or will it follow the horn curve? Will the butt flare to help hold the hand on when chopping?

Help, I am trying to see it in my mind......

Bk.....
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« Reply #39 on: January 17, 2012, 09:04:00 PM »

Thanks Ed! Such a perfect synthethis of the materials ofnature and ingenuity of man, the utility and art..  It is always such a pleasure to view your work. i truly love it!

BK,
Had you thought of asking to have the "adventure knife" on loan from Ed?  - an idea. The three dimensional model itself, to hold examine and use should provide you a better perspective, where descriptions may fall short. This, or getting to the Willow Bow seminar- or to the Blade Show?
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« Reply #40 on: January 17, 2012, 09:23:18 PM »

I think I've made up my mind to go the Blade show and bother Ed. I think that's the best way to go.......

BK.....
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« Reply #41 on: January 19, 2012, 11:33:08 AM »

Ed, does the shape of the horn dictate the finished product. Can you shape it to what ever you want or is the final shape what the horn is..... Huh

BK.....
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« Reply #42 on: January 19, 2012, 11:42:42 AM »

The final shape takes advantage of the initial shape of the horn and is developed as a blend of the knife makers ability to develop the shape that is present at first to the physiology of the human hand that will hold it. This takes a lot of practice and knowledge concerning the purpose of the knife. Essentially it is an adventure in working with nature.
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« Reply #43 on: January 19, 2012, 11:50:47 AM »

Next to the guard the horn is shaped to what you think is the best shape, narrow then thick and then narrow again and then you follow basically the swell of the butt. It looks like you shape the front and leave the back end the same. Is this true?

No criticism Ed, just trying to learn.....

BK....

 
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« Reply #44 on: January 19, 2012, 09:41:07 PM »

After looking at the pictures longer Ed, I see something different than perhaps you do. That's the beauty of using natural material, it can be modified to be what you want and still stand alone...... Wink

The point of the blade is perfect. Once done and honed it shall be excellent. The belly pulled up just a bit will be perfect......... Cool

What a beauty, and perfect balance of design.....

BK......
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