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1  KNIFE TALK / High Endurance Knife Discussion / Re: 80CRV2, anybody experimenting with it? on: August 09, 2017, 12:18:34 PM
Will do, thanks.
2  KNIFE TALK / Ed's Thoughts / Re: Been declared to be an official Cancer Survivor! on: July 23, 2017, 10:04:07 PM
Good to hear Ed, lost too many friends and family to cancer already.
3  KNIFE TALK / High Endurance Knife Discussion / 80CRV2, anybody experimenting with it? on: May 23, 2017, 10:03:43 PM
So far I've been messing with 80CRV2, and I'm liking what I'm seeing so far.  I'm still refining my heat treat, but so far it's taken the place of straight 1084 for smaller stock removal and some forged knives.  Don't think it'll take the place of 52100, but a good alternative to 1084 or 1095 and so far outperforms the simple steels by a good margin.

So far my basic heat treat is to heat to 1525 and quench in 130-140 deg. fast quench, about 8 second oil.  Temper 2 times at 400 deg. for 2 hours each.  Comes out rite at 60 RC and is very tough.  I haven't had time or resources to do any more experiments, but has anyone tried triple quenching it in a slow oil?

I've looked all over the place and found very little heat treat info on it.

4  KNIFE STOREFRONTS / Custom Knife Store / Couple of 52100 hunters for sale on: May 23, 2017, 09:52:54 PM
A couple of hunters for sale.

First up, forged 52100 hunter, bronze guard, stabilized Hawaiian Mango spacer, stabilized curly Maple handle, waxed leather pouch sheath. Blade has 4 3/4" cutting edge, 9 3/4" overall length.

Second, forged 52100, 5 1/8" blade, flat ground with convex edge, 9 7/8" overall length, bronze guard, sheep horn spacer and buffalo handle. Waxed leather pouch sheath. Blade is etched to show quench line and grain.

Both are 350$ each, and come with a zippered storage pouch.  Free shipping in the CONUS.
Please email for more pics, or check out my website,

Thanks for looking,  Will

5  KNIFE TALK / General Discussion / Re: I made a chef! on: May 04, 2017, 09:31:42 PM
Beautiful, nice and slim.  Bet they'd go through a chicken pretty quick!
6  KNIFE TALK / General Discussion / Re: Wet Forging!!?? on: May 04, 2017, 09:30:45 PM
The only time I do it is at certain stages while forging damascus, primarily when I want to blow the scale off just before folding.  It's a useful technique, but like everything else, there is a time and place for it, I never do it when forging mono steels as the temp is too low and what scale there is is flaking off nicely as is.
7  KNIFE TALK / General Discussion / Re: Why no guards? on: May 04, 2017, 09:27:31 PM
Think part of it is how they are used and people think they get in the way.  I don't put a guard on all my knives, but I insist on finger notches, bellies or other shapes, something, to keep the fingers from easily riding up into the edge. 
8  KNIFE TALK / Ed's Thoughts / Re: Cracks in spine on: January 03, 2017, 02:15:56 PM
That makes sense.  I was fully quenching the blades after forging, but only edge quenching on the oven cycles.  I think I'll forgo the quenches from the oven, except for the 800-900 deg. cycle.  The cracks were pretty much right where the edge was quenched coming out of the oven.  It also may be that I was in more of a hurry than I normally am with 52100, I run the oven, quenched the blade to room temp, back in the oven which had cooled, the blade brought the temp the rest of the way down, heat the blade and quench.  All three edge quenches from the oven were done in about an hour.  Seems like I remember doing that a couple days apart before.

9  KNIFE TALK / Ed's Thoughts / Re: Cracks in spine on: January 03, 2017, 10:04:22 AM
Nothing needs to happen fast with steel

I think I'd forgotten that, and the steel reminded me.  Thanks for you input Ed, I will be applying it and hopefully no more cracks.

10  KNIFE TALK / Ed's Thoughts / Re: Cracks in spine on: January 02, 2017, 10:33:12 PM
Well, I thought I got the idea from you, but I may have picked it up somewhere else.  Before I had been doing 3 post forging quenches, 3 annealing cycles of reducing heats, then a 1525 deg normalizing cycle in the oven, followed by a 1200 deg. stress reducing cycle.  Then grind and heat treat.

I forged another blade out, did not do the thermal cycles in the oven yet, but I did a quick grind and no cracks.  This is from the same bar as the cracked blades.  Only thing I did different was to put a couple of normalizing cycles in the mix while forging and used a larger tank with a little more oil.

I'll know more in a couple of days, but I'm thinking it was a combination of too little oil and getting the oil too hot, and maybe needed more stress relief while forging, and maybe doing to many edge quenches. 

I find it kind of funny that a couple of the cracks started right where the quench line runs out on the spine.  Maybe even something as simple as not breaking the edges enough before quenching.

I would love to get up your way and attend one of your courses Ed, but with the economy the way it is, I don't know if that will ever happen. 

Thanks for the insight and help
11  KNIFE TALK / Ed's Thoughts / Re: Cracks in spine on: January 01, 2017, 11:27:45 AM
You mention too fast a quench, I'm using type A quench, but since re working my smithy I've started using a smaller quench tank and during the post forging quenches, and during the thermal cycling in the oven, the oil got hot enough to flame up several times.  I do not believe I've ever had that issue before.  I'm now thinking the oil was hot enough to speed up the quench enough to cause the cracks.  It's possible the blades could have been too hot going into the quench, but I'm very careful when working 52100 about over heating.  One other possibility that comes to mind is I did not do any normalizing heats while forging, only after forging did I normalize.  Normally when forging 52100 I'll throw 3-4 normalizing heats in while forging the bars down, and another 3-4 while forging to shape.  I found out the hard way this is necessary while forging 4140 for tongs and top tools and such if you didn't want it full of cracks.  That and the oil being hotter than normal is the only things I can think of that would be different from the last time I worked 52100.

Ramping the quench temp down is an idea I got from you, Ed.  It's not hardening per say, it's thermal cycling prior to hardening, which is just above critical on each quench.  So far since doing 3 reducing heat quenches and a 900 deg. air cool prior to triple quenching I have had zero issue with warpage.

I will say, even though I did something wrong, the grain at the breaks was very, very fine, so something right is going on as well.  The one thing about 52100, it'll let you know if your messing up.
12  KNIFE TALK / Ed's Thoughts / Cracks in spine on: December 30, 2016, 02:08:49 PM
Not sure if this is where to ask or not, if not please move to the appropriate sub forum.

I just finished forging and thermal cycling a pair of knives from 52100 a couple of days ago.  While grinding and dressing up in preparation for heat treat I noticed a couple of shallow cracks on the spines, towards the points, about an 1" to 1 1/2" back from the point.  They were only about 3/16" to 1/4" deep, I went ahead and broke the blades to see just how bad.

Anyway, here's the heat treat recipe I've been using.  It's been a while since I forged 52100, but I didn't do anything different than I've done before.  Steel is from Rex Walther, or at least I'm 99% sure it was, I do have a few billets from large Timken roller bears on hand when I want to try something weird.

Anyway, forged between 1625 deg. F and 1650 max, when finished forging to shape, left a bit thick, both because of wanting to protect the steel and because 52100 is a bear to move compared to something like 1084, 3 edge quenches in type A oil from critical, held for 30 seconds.  3 Normalizing cycles, first at high end of critical, 2nd just at critical, 3rd below critical.  Then to the oven, 1625, air cool.  Heat to 1600, quench in oil, heat to 1350, quench, heat to 1250, quench, heat to 900 and air cool.  Grind to shape.  This is where I noticed the cracks.

I don't normally do much grinding while thermal cycling, just a quick truing up of the profile.  I'm starting to think I may have left a couple of deep scratches on the spine and since I was edge quenching it put too much stress on it.  But I normally make sure all the scratches are running lengthwise on the spine and edge, and no stress obvious risers on the sides.

Thoughts?  This is the first time in years I've had a failure with 52100, and two in a row from the same bar of steel forged at the same time leads me to thinking there is something I screwed up.
13  KNIFE TALK / High Endurance Knife Discussion / Re: 52100 straight razor? on: December 28, 2016, 11:45:38 AM
Good suggestions, I did mine with 1/8 mycarta and a tapered mycarta wedge.  The only real issue I had was the pining.  I had one piece of 1/16" stock that I bought years ago from who know's where.  It was butter soft.  I've found a source for the washers and pin stock that's reasonable, so I may do the next one with that.  Or, I've been thinking about using 3/32" like you suggested.  Anyway, the first thing I have to do before starting another is to get a 4" wheel, the difference in edge flexibility between a full hollow and a 1/4 hollow makes for a more pleasant shave.
14  KNIFE TALK / High Endurance Knife Discussion / Re: 52100 straight razor? on: December 15, 2016, 10:24:47 AM
I recently started using a Kool Mist sprayer for grinding post heat treat and it'll keep a blade ice cold during grinding.  I grind a few blades in the hard state, especially folders, and the Kool Mist is a nice addition.

I finished one, it has a 3 1/2" blade, that's about an inch too long, and the 8" wheel for grinding makes about a 1/4 hollow, I'll need to get a 4" or 6" wheel to get the 1/2 or better hollow I'm after.  I didn't have the right stuff for pins or washers so I made do and made a few mistakes while doing the handle, but was in a hurry to try it out.  It shaves well, but needs a thicker and wider blade and deeper hollow to get the flexibility at the edge I want, and the long blade makes it somewhat cumbersome as well.

I tried to post a photo, but message said file was full.
15  KNIFE TALK / High Endurance Knife Discussion / Re: 52100 straight razor? on: December 12, 2016, 10:18:15 AM
I've looked at them, but never handled one so I'm not sure exactly how the handle is made to fit the hand.  Also, don't like the idea of not being able to fold the blade into the protective handle, or in other words how do you protect the edge?  Most I've looked at have an asymmetrical grind as well.
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